| noci on Sat, 18 Oct 2003 13:49:29 +0200 (CEST) |
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| Re: <nettime> Linux strikes back III |
Hardie wrote:
Why can't fsfer's think of law and its organisation in ways other than
proprietary/closed systems? Why do people who profess to be at the
cutting edge, pushing Paul Keating's proverbial envelope, feel the need
to hide behind old ways of thinking about law?
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because the rest of the world out there sadly does not function the same
way as the open source community does? or is that just me overly
simplifying things?
I'd like to know more about the "ways other than
proprietary/closed systems"-thinking. what's your idea? was that in your
post or did I miss out on something?
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Geer wrote:
Stallman's position, as I understand it, is that he would have been
happy to use something other than copyright to protect the freedom of
free software, but that as far as he could tell, there was no other way.
Maybe you could suggest one?
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I second that, where is the new spirit?
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Osinga wrote:
But there is nothing against Cisco
selling routers running Linux or Suse charging for CDs with Linux on it,
as long
as people get access to the source code of Cisco routers & Suse
distributions.
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Word! "making money from Linux distributions" [paraphrased; someone here
said that..Myers!] is quite a wide expression. actually, you can get the
whole Suse distribution right here:
ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/current/
what they charge you for is the box, the DVDs/CDs, the documentation,
the support (if ye want it and pay for it).
Of course the GPLed software is the worm on the hook attracting
dollar-stuffed fish, but buying a copy of Windows XP feels a bit
different from buying a box copy of Suse.
picture both acts in your head an you'll know what I mean.
or not.. hurm... Confused!
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Elloi wrote:
...if you want to use so-called legal system and IP property laws you
become just one of the parties that help maintain the whole thing,
enriching lawyers and "leaders" along the way. OS is created by many and
the cause/ideology exploited by a small fraction of loud ones.
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again, what's the alternative? let them pick you apart because you deny
fighting against them with their own (legal) tools?
sounds heroic, but I don't believe these "parties" will stop lobbying
against you simply because you've taken such a brave stance.
Don't get me wrong, I don't have any trust in the legal system/IP
industry either. I'm simply asking for that ethereal alternative vision
which is somehow absent but at the same time subliminally present in
this discussion, somehow.
don't want to insult you either, but your message reminded me of
utterings made by first-year-pseudo-leftist sociology students at the FU
Berlin. ye know, in fact many of them have a bourgeois background that'd
make you gasp for air if they'd ever admit on it.
I simply don't get your line of thinking-- am I dumb or what?
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Hardie wrote:
You see what I am trying to do is move or think about ways of moving the
legal language beyond property and contract at a pace somewhat closer to
the philosophical thinking or logics of the machine.
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hurm your message sounds interesting. what do you think could happen in
praxis, though?
how can the OS community react against "threats" such as Cisco's actions
on these new lines of thinking?
thinking about that Cisco fiasco:
they do nothing but Warez- making money from selling software whose
license agreement they've violated.
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right i'm going back to lurk-mode now.. i'm not an expert in any of
these issues (but you know that already from my post :-) but this
discussion really struck a nerve with me, especially as this is only the
tip of an underlying iceberg comprised of more topics than just OS vs IP
etc.
this whole distributed creativity thing is new to me, y'know.. :P
greets,
maxd
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